Immigration

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Grandad
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Immigration

Post by Grandad » Wed Sep 11, 2019 7:30 pm

Yesterday 86 illegal immigrants crossed the 22 miles of the English channel to Britain in a variety of inflatable craft many little more than a family dinghy. They will all be processed by the border agency and allowed to stay pending a decision on each individual case. We have a very poor record of repatriation of immigrants and very few have been sent home or to the country that they came from, ie France.
My daughter in law is French, she came here as an au pair nearly 30 years ago. She has always been in work and paid all her taxes, national insurance etc and now holds a middle management job with Eurotunnel. As a bi-linguist she spends working time on both sides of the channel. She has been married to my son for 20 years, their son has dual nationality and two passports. While we were in the EU she did not chose or need to apply for British citizenship.
Now, with the advent of Brexit, she is required to apply for residency because, in law, she will become an illegal immigrant when we leave the EU. Even with her record of living here she is concerned. There have been cases where people in similar circumstances have been required to leave the UK and return to their country of birth.
I am now convinced that our whole political system has gone crazy and, not to put too fine a point on it, we have the craziest politician as a PM.
:xx


:gg:

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Re: Immigration

Post by FABlux » Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:20 pm

The whole thing is a farce isn't it Grandad? I am so sorry for your daughter in law the uncertainty must be awful.

We still don't know exactly what is happening here in France, the Carte de Sejour system got a bit bogged down and then they suspended it until they know what the UK is doing about a deal. They have stated that they "will take a 'generous and flexible' view of the position of British nationals, eg, age, health, duration of residence, family circumstances, etc." & next month they will launch an English language online registration platform for applications for UK nationals living in France. I guess all anybody can do is hope for the best & be ready to fill out lots of forms!

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Re: Immigration

Post by Horus » Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:34 pm

The UK was the first country to offer equal treatment for EU citizens living here, it was the EU who did not take up the offer.
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Re: Immigration

Post by Grandad » Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:35 pm

Horus wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:34 pm
The UK was the first country to offer equal treatment for EU citizens living here, it was the EU who did not take up the offer.
Maybe so Horus but that is little consolation to my daughter in law and others who find themselves in a similar situation to hers.
:gg:

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Re: Immigration

Post by Horus » Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:42 am

Grandad, surely if she is married to your son then she has British citizenship?
Then again she should be complaining to her own country of birth as it is they (the EU) who have refused to discuss the reciprocal arrangements that would have given the right to remain to people in your DIL's position on both sides of the channel, it was one of the first things that the UK offered to agree with the EU and retain the current status quo, but they refused to discuss this outside of a full exit deal being agreed.
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Re: Immigration

Post by Grandad » Thu Sep 12, 2019 10:21 am

Horus wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:42 am
Grandad, surely if she is married to your son then she has British citizenship?
I agree Horus that one would expect that on marriage to a Brit, that would entitle you to citizenship but that is not the case.
While in the EU she has every right to live here. She chose to keep her French citizenship, maybe so that any children would be entitled to dual nationality, I don't know that for sure.
If after marriage she had applied for citizenship she would have had to give up her French passport and get a British one. As it was not necessary I doubt if she gave that a thought. She is now completely Anglicised and loves her life here but is proud of her French heritage. I am sure she will be granted residency but it is an example of a problem created by Brexit.
Don't get me wrong, I am a firm 'leaver' but I am concerned about some of the predictions if there is 'No Deal'. They are saying that lorries at the Dover crossing could be held up for up to 2 days while documentation is cleared. Many European freighters are saying that they will no longer transport across the channel.
If there ia no deal, I can see real trouble ahead. :xx
:gg:

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Re: Immigration

Post by Horus » Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:17 pm

I think you are falling for 'project fear' Grandad, of course there will be problems, but all we are hearing is doom & gloom from the Remoaners, what about all the bad things that will happen if we remain in the EU? no one is given a platform in order to point all that out as far as I can see. All this rubbish they are trotting out now about leaked papers is just that utter garbage. It is a 'risk assessment' and anyone who has ever done one will know that you include all the worst scenarios regardless of how unlikely they are to occur and then you make a plan as to how you prevent those things from happening, any sensible government will do that. Even the most ardent Remoaners have to admit that any disruption to the UK is unlikely to last more than 3 months, I can live with that. As for your other point, well much as I may sympathise with her position it is resolvable and we cannot be held hostage by the choices of someone who wishes to remain a foreign national, that becomes a European issue and not a UK one, although as I stated earlier the EU were offered the reciprocal arrangement and they declined.
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Re: Immigration

Post by LovelyLadyLux » Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:14 pm

@Grandad - I'm a bit confused re: your d-i-l in that I'm not grasping the 'why' she would have to give up her French passport? Couldn't she have both by being a Dual citizen?

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Re: Immigration

Post by Grandad » Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:26 pm

LovelyLadyLux wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:14 pm
@Grandad - I'm a bit confused re: your d-i-l in that I'm not grasping the 'why' she would have to give up her French passport? Couldn't she have both by being a Dual citizen?
Apparently not LLL. You can only have dual citizenship if you have dual nationality parents, like their son Louis. To get a British passport she would have to take British nationality and relinquish her French status. :(
:gg:

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Re: Immigration

Post by Horus » Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:37 pm

There is something wrong with this information Grandad, both France and the UK allow their citizens to have dual nationalities, ergo they may hold two passports. I think that LLL can confirm that some Canadians were actually born in the United States and don’t know that they hold a second nationality as “accidental Americans” and the Canadian government actively encourage those people to exercise that right but to enter their second country on their Canadian passport.
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Re: Immigration

Post by LovelyLadyLux » Fri Sep 13, 2019 5:01 am

There are lots of people here who hold dual Canadian/US citizenship and don't necessarily have 1 parent Canadian and 1 parent US. LOTS of Americans fled to Canada to escape the Vietnam War. Lots of them now hold dual citizenship.

Am thinking the system here is different than there (which is why I'm confused - but that seems a normal state for me these days ;) )

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Re: Immigration

Post by LovelyLadyLux » Fri Sep 13, 2019 5:02 am

I should add that usually, typically re: Canada & USA people first become Permanent Residents then after (I think) 5yrs can go for citizenship.

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Re: Immigration

Post by Horus » Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:34 am

There are lots of rights for obtaining citizenship in the UK LLL and currently the 5 year application right exists. As we have had over 3 years since the decision to leave the EU was passed, then why have people not sorted that out before now? the same goes for those Brits living in other EU counties. It is no use waiting for years and then making it a UK Brexit problem and I will say it again, the UK offered the EU the right to remain for people already here provided it was a reciprocal agreement for UK citizens living in the EU. Even though it was a one sided agreement for the UK because we have 3.5 million Europeans living in the UK that would qualify as opposed to only around 1.5 million Brits spread throughout the EU countries, they still refused the offer. :urm: So they should all be complaining to the EU for their intransigence in doing a deal and not to the UK.
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Re: Immigration

Post by Grandad » Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:24 pm

Horus wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:37 pm
There is something wrong with this information Grandad, both France and the UK allow their citizens to have dual nationalities, ergo they may hold two passports.
That may well be the case H, I am only quoting what my son told me and I would assume that they would have checked what is required.
I did Google to try to find what the situation really is but it is a bit of a minefield so, as it doesn't affect me, I gave up. :lol:
:gg:

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Re: Immigration

Post by Horus » Fri Sep 13, 2019 3:26 pm

Well some good news at least in that Boris has announced a £1.3 Billion order for at least 5 new naval vessels to be built entirely in the UK, that should go some way in preserving jobs in Northern shipyards. We should never have allowed such vital industries to be lost by allowing cheaper imports from Polish and Asian shipyards in the first place, hopefully this will be the start of a reversal of the decimation of our industries by EU directives.
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Re: Immigration

Post by Grandad » Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:26 pm

@Horus
H, your last post prompted me to mention three TV programs that i watched earlier in the week. I think they were repeats put on in the afternoon but they were about top end engineering in the UK.
The first was about building a nuclear submarine, the second about building Rolls Royce Trent aero engines and the third was about upgrading Chinook dual rota helicopters. It really brought home where all the expenditure goes but it was all superb engineering, particularly at RR. :up :up
:gg:

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